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One speaker recounts that he did not like Bibi Netanyahu, describing Netanyahu as a destructive force and saying he was appalled by what was happening in Gaza, and that Netanyahu was using the United States to prosecute wars for the benefit of his country, which he called shameful and embarrassing and bad for the United States, a view he resented. He also notes that he didn’t hate Netanyahu. After that speech, there was a sharp backlash against Charlie Kirk and, to a lesser extent, the speaker, with Kirk having about $100 million in donors and being heavily dependent on them because his project was nonprofit. They went after him and tormented him, while a small, very intense group offended by the speech tormented Charlie Kirk until the day he died.

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Speaker 1 questions the letter's truth; Speaker 2 confirms, "Yeah. I mean, it's it's real." They reference Nick Fuentes claiming Israel killed Charlie and mention "the call, like, Israel called him and told him to to to." Speaker 2 summarizes Charlie's Israel stance as nuanced: "he wanted people who controlled The Holy Land to be civilized people" and "didn't want it to be in the hands of Islam," preferring "a civilized group ... friendly to the West" over hostile Muslim nations. He was frustrated at being unable to criticize Israel without being labeled an anti Semitic, and had vehement disagreements about how the war was prosecuted and messaged; he wanted it to be over and saw more freedom to criticize America than Israel. "Even Tucker Carlson" noted Charlie Kirk's anti Semitic labeling; "BB's comments" were odd; he hosted critics like Dave Smith and recognized that "young people were much more Israeli skeptic," arguing that silencing debate would be a "huge disservice to the conservative movement."

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Charlie mentioned Tucker and Candace forty eight hours earlier as they were trying to control who he's allowed to speak to. He was worried that Israel was infringing upon speech in America; "I have text messages to that effect." He was genuinely pro Israel; "there was nothing. there was not payment that was coming in." Toward the end, he was "over it towards the end because of Jewish behavior". Less than forty eight hours before he died, "Charlie announces that he has no choice but to abandon the pro Israel cause because of Jewish donors and their behavior living up to these stereotypes." We never said "Israel killed Charlie Kirk." "I am uncomfortable with how many lies people that support Israel have been telling in the wake of his death."

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I was shocked and sickened by the reaction of the ghoulish and really repulsive reaction of the prime minister of Israel, Benjamin Netanyahu, to Charlie's death. He basically made it all about him and redirected the grief toward support for his project. "Benjamin Netanyahu is not the same as the nation of Israel at all." "BB's defenders, on the Internet will call me a liar or a kook, but that's a fact." "what he said was completely untrue." "Charlie didn't hate Jews. He loved Jews. He loved the state of Israel. He loved going there." "He did not like Bibi Netanyahu, and he said that to me many times." "He felt that Bibi Netanyahu was a very destructive force." "He was resentful that he believed Netanyahu was using The United States to prosecute his wars for the benefit of his country." "Shortly after that speech, there was a very intense attack on Charlie; he had $100,000,000 worth of donors." "Two days before he died, he lost a $2,000,000 donation because he had publicly pledged to bring me to the next Turning Point Conference in December." "They put out a flyer basically saying that I was going to be at this event giving a speech."

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Asked about the last meeting with Charlie, it wasn't 'about, like, this is what you should say,' but 'talking through the issues' with Charlie asking questions and 'then saying, Okay, I think I'm going to approach this issue this way and this is going to be my position on it.' They discussed 'USA to Israel,' and 'I'm opposed to USA to Israel. I want it to be drawn down,' noting Netanyahu's stance. They talked through 'why is Israel actually an American interest?' 'Why is it in America's interest to support Israel?' Charlie was a listener, and 'the open marketplace of ideas' was a core fundamental. He believed in that, which is why he annoyed people by platforming Tucker Carlson and others, because for Charlie, 'the idea that you're supposed to silence any opinion was anathema.' 'Do I think he went too far with it? Well, yes.'

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I was shocked and sickened by the ghoulish and really repulsive reaction of the prime minister of Israel, Benjamin Netanyahu, to Charlie's death, basically made it all about him and his country, redirecting the grief toward support for his projects. Charlie Kirk did not hate Jews. "Charlie didn't hate Jews. He loved Jews." He did not like Bibi Netanyahu, and he felt that B. Netanyahu was a very destructive force; "he was above all resentful that he believed Netanyahu was using The United States to prosecute his wars for the benefit of his country, and that it was shameful and embarrassing and bad for The United States, and he resented it." After that speech, there was an intense attack on Charlie; "He had $100,000,000 worth of donors." Two days before he died, he lost a $2,000,000 donation because he had publicly pledged to bring me to the next Turning Point conference in December. The American Jewish Committee called Charlie Kirk an anti Semite and "dangerous." He was not an anti Semite. He was the opposite, and he was a great lover of people and a purveyor of peace. Seth Dillon of the Babylon Bee was out there demanding that Charlie Kirk take me off the roster, pull me off stage, because I had said things that BB didn't like or that he didn't like or whatever. This is a trend.

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The senator advocates for regime change in Iran via a popular uprising, clarifying he does not support military force for this purpose. He identifies as a "non-interventionist hawk," prioritizing U.S. national security interests in foreign policy decisions. The discussion shifts to U.S. foreign policy failures in Syria, Iraq, and Libya, with the senator opposing intervention in those countries. He considers the collapse of the Soviet Union a successful regime change. The senator defends military aid to Israel as beneficial to U.S. security, citing intelligence sharing and a commonality of enemies. He acknowledges that allies spy on each other. He denies that APAC, the American Israeli Political Action Committee, is a foreign lobby. The senator believes Iran is actively trying to murder Donald Trump and has hired hitmen. He supports Israel taking out Iran's military leadership and nuclear capacity. He opposed the Iraq war and military intervention in Syria, but believes Iran is different because it poses a threat to the U.S. The senator blames Biden's weakness for the war in Ukraine. He says that Nord Stream 2 sanctions legislation that he authored prevented a war. He voted for the initial tranche of funding for the Ukraine war, but voted against subsequent funding streams.

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Speaker 0 says Charlie bridged foreign policy gaps due to "genuine affection for Israel," and he privately expressed that he "love Israel." He argued, "we should not have another forever war, regime change war against Iran," and that view made him approachable because "this person doesn't hate me. It doesn't need to get existential. It's not about disliking me or some weird bigotry." He urged continuing in "the spirit that he operated in, which is one of love for other people, including people we disagree with." Speaker 1 notes Charlie was "a hardliner on immigration" who "wanted us to control our borders as much as possible" and who "wanted us to ramp up the deportations." He recalls Charlie asking, "why aren't the deportations higher? Why aren't you doing more?" He adds, "I'm a free citizen. I love you guys. I supported you guys, and I'm going to use my platform to try to accomplish as much good as I possibly can." He concludes, "I think that made him such an effective operator."

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Charlie was trying to navigate this to keep the Nick Fuentes, neo Nazi, groyper stuff at bay while meeting Gen Z on their terms and guiding them toward a better place without the outmoded rhetoric and talking points of the 1970s, 1980s boomers. He aimed to "hold the line, to keep the Fuentes, Ruiper stuff decidedly on the fringe, very much out of the tent, at the movement." Charlie saw himself as a coalition leader of really MAGA, of the American right there, and sought a middle-ground foreign policy between Ron Paul isolationism and George W. Bush neoconservatism. Ali is probably why he gravitated towards my book and the Trump doctrine—conservative realist nationalist middle ground between the two poles. Think that's kind of why Charlie and I kind of saw eye to eye to eye analysis towards the end of his life. I think Tucker Carlson is a malicious anti Semite. I think he is the most dangerous anti Semite in the history of The United States.

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"the war on terror had been a net loss for The United States, and it caused incalculable damage, not just economic and physical damage, but spiritual damage to The United States. It was it was bad. We got nothing out of it. We were only hurt." He recalls a backstage conversation before a July speech, railing against "the effort by the neocons in The United States to draw us in to another forever war with Iran," noting that Iraq had been entered "at the behest of those same foreign policy strategists, and it didn't work." He resisted mentioning it publicly at first, but was urged to "Go all the way. Do it." He then did. He mentions Epstein: "Epstein clearly had contact with Israeli intelligence and American intelligence and French intelligence, but the only one you're not allowed to talk about is Israeli intelligence." I was shocked and sickened by the reaction of the ghoulish and really repulsive reaction of the prime minister of in Israel, Benjamin Netanyahu, to Charlie's death.

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From Israel's perspective, "Charlie Kirk is the pro Zionist guy. He is the pro Israel guy." The speaker notes that without context it wouldn’t make sense to claim Israel would kill him, but asks what if they were listening and he was in communications with people saying, "hey. I think I'm gonna go this direction and they knew his intentions or saw this pattern." They describe "this pro Zionist guy with this incredibly powerful platform that they built, by the way, that Charlie has, thanks to them," and warn that if "he's gonna take what they gave him and turn it against them" it "could literally destroy Israel because the youth is people they're most concerned about." Charlie "is the dude when it comes to Israel." "We can't let him turn" and if he starts to turn and "we take him out before he ever really genuinely turns, and then he's the Zionist martyr"—blame on the Palestinian—could "unify the right" and silence critics. The speaker concedes: "I Israel was never my top suspect" but now thinks "it's not unreasonable" and that "it's in their wheelhouse." It shows how much they needed Charlie Kirk—"nobody's gonna be defending them anymore" and "their reputation is in the toilet."

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Benjamin Netanyahu is not the same as the nation of Israel at all. "Bibi is despised by many people, in Israel." There are "huge divisions within the Israeli government," and "parts of the intel world in Israel that do not support some things Benjamin Netanyahu has done recently." "his attempt to hijack Charlie's memory and use it for his own political ends, particularly because what he said was completely untrue." "Charlie didn't hate Jews. He loved Jews. He loved the state of Israel, loved going there." He "did not like Bibi Netanyahu, and he said that to me many times, and to people around him many times." "He felt that Bibi Netanyahu was a very destructive force." He was "appalled by what was happening in Gaza," and he "resented Netanyahu using The United States to prosecute his wars for the benefit of his country, and that it was shameful and embarrassing and bad for The United States."

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The senator supports regime change in Iran via popular uprising, not military force. He defines his foreign policy as a "non-interventionist hawk," prioritizing US national security interests. He opposed military action in Syria and the Iraq War, viewing Iran as different due to its threat to the US. The senator believes supporting Israel is in America's national security interest, citing intelligence sharing and a commonality of enemies. He acknowledges Israel likely spies on the US, as do other allies. He defends APAC as lobbying for a strong US-Israeli relationship, not for the Israeli government. He believes Iran is trying to murder Donald Trump and has paid hitmen to do so. He also believes that the US should protect the president and take out our enemies, and that Israel is doing that right now. He attributes the war in Ukraine to Biden's weakness and the waiving of sanctions on Nord Stream 2, and thinks Zelenskyy is behaving horribly. He thinks blowing up Nord Stream 2 was a good thing. He accuses the interviewer of defending Russia, while the interviewer says that he is defending Western Europe.

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He did not like B. B. Netanyahu. He felt that B. B. Netanyahu was a very destructive force and was appalled by what was happening in Gaza. He was resentful that he believed Netanyahu was using The United States to prosecute his wars for the benefit of his country, and that it was shameful and embarrassing and bad for The United States. He resented it and didn't hate Netanyahu. "There's no question that BB's defenders, on the internet will call me a liar or a kook. But that's a fact." "Enough text messages exist that I think it can probably be verified in pretty short order." Shortly after that speech, there was "a very intense attack on Charlie" and "I have no donors." He had "$100,000,000" worth of donors. "They went after him and tormented him ... until the day he died."

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The senator supports regime change in Iran via a popular uprising, not military force. He considers himself a "non-interventionist hawk," prioritizing US national security interests and advocating "peace through strength." He opposed military action in Syria, but views Iran as different due to its anti-American stance and pursuit of nuclear weapons. He believes the US military support for Israel is massively in America's national security. He acknowledges Israel likely spies on the US, but accepts it as a reality among allies. He defends APAC as an American lobby focused on strengthening US-Israeli relations, not acting as a foreign agent. The senator believes Iran is actively trying to murder Donald Trump and has paid hitmen to do so. He supports Israel's actions to take out Iran's military leadership and nuclear capacity. He opposed the Iraq War and military intervention in Libya, citing negative consequences for the US. He also believes that Joe Biden's weakness caused the war in Ukraine.

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Charlie was loyal to people with whom he had shared history. He would never say an ill word about Candace and refused moral blackmail. He stayed loyal to old donors and Turning Point colleagues, avoided airing dirty laundry, and, though he disagreed with Candace and Tucker on the Israel issue, he recognized Tucker’s value and invited him to events. He could not be controlled or bought, and when faced with threats to cut large donations, he reacted with defiance: “screw me. No. Screw you.” He loved Israel and the Holy Land, and, amid a surge of anti-Israel sentiment on the right, he tried to chart a path forward for sympathizers. He wrote to Bibi: “You are losing the PR war. You need to change how you do your PR. You need to change your messaging to the American right,” suggesting a more passive relationship and opposing Islamic migration. He vented privately when accused of antisemitism, but publicly avoided such disclosures.

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Speaker recounts meeting with Charlie: it wasn’t about 'this is what you should say,' but 'talking through the issues' as Charlie asked questions and began forming positions. He would 'approach this issue this way' and decide his stance on topics like 'USA to Israel,' which speaker opposed, wanting it drawn down; Netanyahu has said he wants it drawn down. Charlie would articulate his position more quickly than the speaker. They discussed why is Israel actually an American America's interest to support Israel and explored approaches to justify it, not just those favored by Israelis or the Israeli government, but ways to help Charlie feel comfortable with a position. Charlie is a 'listener' who believes in the 'open marketplace of ideas'—his existential core—and he platformed Tucker Carlson; silencing any opinion was 'anathema' to him because of truth seeking. 'For all of us, our best traits we often have to a fault.'

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I don't think we should have another forever war, regime change war against Iran. Don't do that. That turns everybody off. You don't help your own cause by doing that, and it's also literally untrue. The spirit that he operated in, which is one of love for other people, including people we disagree with, and don't make it, you know, as small bore as that. Charlie was a hardliner on immigration. He wanted us to control our borders as much as possible. He wanted us to ramp up the deportations. Why aren't the deportations higher? Why aren't you doing more? I'm a free citizen. I love you guys. I supported you guys, and I'm going to use my platform to try to accomplish as much good as I possibly can. I think that made him such an effective operator. And I would talk to Charlie.

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As he was preparing for his campus tour, he decided that he wanted to have a meeting. Josh Hammer was on the call. I was on the call and a couple of Charlie's staff to talk through Israel issues. He was he was really grappling with these issues. I remember right after October 7, I was a little concerned about some of the things he was saying afterwards, and I wasn't so emotional. But I realized Charlie was looking at a lot of the Israel America stuff through the America first lens. The fact that he was meeting with you to refine his talking points, I assumed there was a lot of pushback. When when, you know, that reporter asked me what the mood of the meeting was, and I said it was combative. There's also within him a very faithful, bible believing evangelical Christian.

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Good faith is the measure: 'If you were good faith, you're on his team.' They warn against appropriating his memory for parochial ends. He bridged foreign policy gaps with genuine affection for Israel: 'I love Israel. I don't think we should have another forever war, regime change war against Iran.' Charlie was a hardliner on immigration, wanting to 'control our borders' and asking, 'why aren't the deportations higher?' He believed 'Pressure is a friend. Pressure is somebody who cares deeply about the issue.' He warned that Iran strikes could become a regime change war: 'This can't become a bigger thing. This can't become a broader thing.' He could support Israel and 'did eventually support the strikes on the nuclear facility while simultaneously saying no more.' Donors to Turning Point were 'very tough on him... under enormous pressure.' 'He never bent. He never became better.' His integrity 'to the very end.'

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Charlie Kirk's perspective on Israel was not starting to shift. It had shifted entirely. Israel knew that. Turning Point USA knew that because Charlie was explicit. He wrote of his deep love for Israel. About forty eight hours before Charlie Kirk died, Charlie informed people at Turning Point, as well as Jewish donors and a rabbi that he had no choice but to abandon the pro Israel cause outright. Charlie was done. He said it explicitly that he refused to be bullied anymore by the Jewish donors. Did he express that? Did he also express that he wanted to bring me, Candace Owens, back because he was standing up for himself? And then did he, just forty eight hours later, conveniently catch a bullet to the throat before our on stage reunion could happen?

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I was shocked and sickened by the reaction of the ghoulish and really repulsive reaction of the prime minister of Israel, Benjamin Netanyahu, to Charlie's death. Basically made it all about him and all about his country immediately trying to take the energy, the sadness, the grief that people felt over Charlie's murder and redirect it towards support for whatever project he's involved in. Benjamin Netanyahu is not the same as the nation of Israel at all. Bibi is despised by many people in Israel. There are huge divisions within the Israeli government. I mean, are certain parts of the intel world in Israel that do not support some things that Benjamin Netanyahu has done recently. Charlie didn't hate Jews. He loved Jews. He had tons of friends who were Jews. He loved the state of Israel. Loved going there. He did not like B. B. Netanyahu, and he said that to me many times, and he said to people around him many times. He felt that Bibi Netanyahu was a very destructive force. He was appalled by what was happening in Gaza. He was above all resentful that he believed Netanyahu was using The United States to prosecute his wars for the benefit of his country, and that it was shameful and embarrassing and bad for The United States, and he resented it. There's no question that BB's defenders on the internet will call me a liar or a kook, but that's a fact. Enough text messages exist that I think it can probably be verified in pretty short order.

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Charlie was loyal to people he had shared history with; he would say, "We're friends." He would never say an ill word about Candace, and if pressed to attack Tucker, he would be defiant because he didn't wanna be morally blackmailed. He remained loyal to donors and Turning Point staff and would not air any dirty laundry. He did disagree with Candace on the Israel issue and with Tucker on Israel, but "Tucker was a useful voice in the conservative movement on many things," and he invited him to events. "You could not buy him he was not bought and paid for." He loved Israel and cared about the holy Land, aware of anti-Israel sentiment on the right. He wrote to Bibi: "You are losing the PR war," signaling PR changes, including American support and opposing Islamic migration. He vented to pro-Israel peers and kept it to avoid betraying friends.

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Speaker 0 and Speaker 1 address a group text shared by Kent Owens; the text grab is authentic and, though private, was released to show public frustrations and pursue justice for Charlie. They say they wanted no stone unturned in the first 33 hours of the investigation. As Turning Point USA spokesman, they caution that public statements could affect an ongoing case. Charlie's Israel views are described as nuanced and public: he cared about Israel, read a 700-page history, wanted the Gaza war to end, did not want American troops or Palestinian refugees, saw Hamas as the aggressor, and noted antisemitism rising. A Megyn Kelly clip is cited: "I love Israel. I want Israel to win." Charlie remained defiant, refusing to be cowed into deplatforming Tucker, upholding "free speech be our north star."

The Megyn Kelly Show

Nancy Guthrie 2013 Segment, Ben vs. Piers, and Charlie Kirk's Mission of Dialogue, w/ Kolvet & Neff
Guests: Nancy Guthrie, Kolvet, Neff
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Megyn Kelly opens from a remote location, reflecting on production hiccups and diving into the week’s pressing political and media stories. The episode pivots around the Nancy Guthrie case, where Kelly highlights the sensational footage of Guthrie’s bedroom broadcast on The Today Show in 2013 and the eerie implications of broadcasting a private space in a high-profile missing-person investigation. She connects the discussion to how such footage could influence investigators or mislead the public, and she laments the over-sharing culture on television while stressing the importance of distinguishing fact from opinion for listeners. The conversation then shifts to Iran and US foreign policy, with Kelly explaining Charlie Kirk’s cautious stance toward war and emphasizing the need to balance strong national defense with the political risks of prolonged conflict. The panel delves into internal debates within conservative circles about the best course of action, messaging to independents, and the potential electoral cost of a protracted conflict, underscoring Charlie’s influence on aligning foreign policy choices with a broad conservative coalition. A recurring thread throughout the show is media bias and the availability of mischaracterizations in mainstream outlets. The hosts scrutinize CNN’s coverage of a New York City terror incident, CBS’s portrayal of suspects on screen, and Abby Phillip’s on-air errors, arguing that the press often labels or frames events in ways that serve particular narratives. In response, Andrew Kovvette and Blake Nef defend Turning Point’s approach to hosting a range of voices, including skeptical or nuanced takes on foreign policy, while acknowledging the enduring challenge of maintaining unity within a movement. Interwoven segments honor Charlie Kirk’s legacy, describing how Turning Point staff continue his mission, mourn his passing, and emphasize faith, resilience, and duty in the face of political division. The episode closes with reflections on contemporary celebrity culture, including critiques of Gwyneth Paltrow and Whoopi Goldberg and a broader critique of Hollywood’s public personas, and a brief look at a controversial moment involving Bill Clinton, which Kelly frames as a cultural symbol of political power dynamics. The overarching theme is the tension between pursuing a coherent political strategy and navigating a media landscape perceived as biased or sensationalist, with the goal of informing and mobilizing viewers without sacrificing accuracy or civility.
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