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In Keeping It Real, Jillian Michaels hosts Dr. Sabine Hazan, a gastroenterologist who has spent three decades in clinical trials and microbiome research. Hazan describes how her lab shifted focus during the pandemic to study the gut microbiome’s role in COVID-19, including attempts to detect the virus in stool and to understand how microbial balance might influence disease severity. She explains writing 57 research protocols and building standardized methods for sample collection and analysis, likening protocols to screenplays that guide experiments from stool collection to data interpretation. Hazan argues that the microbiome not only reflects health but can shape immune responses, potentially affecting asymptomatic cases and vulnerability to infection. Hazan recounts the suppression she perceives around certain treatments and findings, such as vitamin C and vitamin D protocols, hydroxychloroquine early in the crisis, and especially ivermectin. She describes censorship on social media and hesitation from institutions, arguing that political polarization interfered with scientific discourse and patient care. The discussion moves to her ivermectin work, including a personal clinical pivot from hydroxychloroquine to ivermectin and doxycycline, observations about how gut bacteria like Bifidobacteria relate to COVID outcomes, and hypotheses about how the gut-lung axis might mediate inflammation and recovery. She details a controversial arc of hypothesis, retraction, and subsequent data, contending that journals and researchers are influenced by broader forces, while insisting that listening to patients and pursuing open inquiry are essential to medical progress. The conversation then broadens to vaccines, adverse events, and the idea that mRNA technologies require careful, independent scrutiny. Hazan discusses observing changes in patients’ microbiomes after vaccination, concerns about persistent effects on beneficial microbes, and the need for transparent reporting of adverse events. She advocates for independent, nonprofit scientific work and emphasizes collaborative, global learning about the microbiome’s diversity. The episode closes with Hazan’s call for humility in medicine, a push for open dialogue, and a vision of a microbiome-informed future where different cultures’ microbial ecosystems enrich our understanding of health rather than divide it.

On this episode, Theo Von welcomes Robert F. Kennedy Jr., whose book The Real Anthony Fauci is a central topic of discussion. Kennedy describes his research process, including a 300‑plus‑member email list of actors, MDs, and scientists that lets him see new studies in real time and hear critical analyses of them. He argues that agency capture taints public health and environmental regulators, with the FDA funded largely by pharmaceutical companies and fast‑track approvals turning regulators into partners of industry. He contends the COVID response prioritized profits over lives, noting that early treatment was minimized and hospitalizations and ventilator use followed Fauci’s regimens. He cites hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin as effective in early treatment, says NIH studies in 2005 and later showed HCQ's potential, and accuses Gates and others of funding studies designed to discredit these drugs by using hospitalized patients and overdosing. He claims there were coercive incentives for hospitals to code deaths as COVID and to use Remdesivir, driving up counts and profits. Kennedy criticizes social and traditional media for pharma‑driven censorship, recounting his experience with Fox News where advertising revenue from pharma influenced editorial choices. He links Big Tech to the pharmaceutical industry, claiming Google and Facebook manage vaccine content and data to protect profits. He asserts direct‑to‑consumer advertising fueled this power and notes the lack of liability for vaccine manufacturers under the EUA framework, arguing that the Pfizer trial’s six‑month data showed vaccines did not clearly prevent death or transmission and appeared to increase all‑cause mortality. The discussion covers Event 201, gain‑of‑function research funded through USAID and DARPA, and the Wuhan lab network. Kennedy connects these to broader concerns about surveillance, vaccine passports, programmable money, and the erosion of civil liberties, urging three daily acts of civil disobedience to reclaim rights. He highlights autism links with vaccines in some studies and defends publishing with extensive references. The interview closes with praise for the book, a call to resist, and thanks to Kennedy for joining.

In this episode, Bret Weinstein challenges the conventional Darwinian narrative by proposing a powerful, overlooked layer in evolution that accelerates the emergence of diverse forms. He argues that random mutations in protein-coding genes can explain nanoscale changes well, but fail to account for major leaps such as the transition from limb to wing. The conversation delves into EvoDevo, developmentally oriented biology, and the idea that organisms store and manipulate a broad library of variables in the genome—numbers and timing signals that govern development, growth, and adaptive leaps. Weinstein uses telomeres, microsatellites, and dosage effects as entry points to illustrate how non–protein-based information could modulate phenotypes, potentially expanding the adjacent possible and enabling rapid shifts in form once new ecological opportunities arise, such as flight in bats. The discussion weaves through how such a framework would be Darwinian in spirit, subsuming, rather than overturning, classical mechanisms, while highlighting gaps in mainstream evolutionary theory and the need for a more integrated view of mechanisms and selective processes. He then connects these ideas to broader questions about technology and culture, arguing that humans employ an intercoupled system of biological and cultural evolution—where the “campfire” of shared ideas and tools accelerates adaptation. The guests explore how human cognition functions as an explorer mode, testing designs mentally and prototyping them in the world, a process that may explain cultural explosions and rapid shifts in behavior. They examine the capacity of the genome to store variables, the role of variable number tandem repeats, and the possibility that development is steered by “integers” in DNA that influence timing, expression, and morphogenesis. A recurring theme is the tension between gradualism and leap-taking in evolution, and the potential for a more powerful, quantitative toolkit to illuminate how ordinary mechanisms can generate extraordinary diversity without abandoning Darwinian logic. The conversation also covers current debates around vaccines, repurposed drugs such as Ivermectin, and medical science’s reliance on randomized trials. The speakers critique institutional incentives and media narratives surrounding COVID-19, vaccines, and public health policy, while contrasting the elegance of simple, transparent analyses (for example, chi-squared tests) with complex trials that can be biased or manipulated. They reflect on the role of free speech, censorship, and digital platforms in shaping scientific discourse, and contemplate how to sustain robust, open inquiry in an era of rapid tech-driven change and political polarization.