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Speaker 1 claims that no vaccines, including the COVID vaccine, have been properly tested. They assert that no childhood vaccine has undergone a placebo-controlled clinical trial of sufficient duration and power to assess its safety before being injected into millions of children in America. Speaker 1 states this is not just their opinion, but can be verified by anyone who examines the FDA website, specifically the package inserts and underlying clinical trial documents.

The speaker claims that the evidence around vaccines and autism in the U.S. consists of two flawed and fraudulent CDC studies. One study allegedly showed a statistically significant effect of the MMR vaccine, with 67% more boys receiving the vaccine on time being diagnosed with autism compared to those who waited until age three. The speaker says a whistleblower, Dr. William Thompson, came forward with this information in 2013 and 2014. The speaker also alleges that the Verstraten study in 2003 is flawed and fraudulent, accusing them of cherry-picking information from the Vaccine Safety Datalink. The speaker asserts there is a significant gap in the science around vaccines and autism, stating that safety cannot be determined by looking at one vaccine or component in isolation.

The difference between a food chemical and a drug is intended use; if intended for food, almost anything can be synthesized and added. The speaker claims we are being mass-drugged and poisoned by 10,000 virtually unregulated chemicals in our food. Monsanto's glyphosate litigation revealed ghostwritten papers claiming its safety, illustrating corruption. The speaker believes these unregulated chemicals are making us sick. Evidence-based approaches requiring long studies to prove harm from substances like glyphosate are flawed. The speaker asserts that the synergistic combination of toxins causes pleiotropic health issues, requiring common sense to understand the problem.

Speaker 0 argues that the science is very incorrect and very bad science, aside from all the other material Jill Demenov and US Right to Know uncovered. They claim those sources went overboard to disprove something without good data, and that the manipulation and intent to tell a story that is not substantiated are the reasons why they should be retracted. They also state that these people do not have the courage or the decency to retract.

Danish study on aluminum in vaccines should be retracted, scientists say. The article by doctor Hvid, an apologist for aluminum in vaccines from Denmark, was caught. The first appendix published with the journal was not the right one; after press hoopla, the correct statistics were published. Senior scientist Collie Blanowski analyzed and said, 'they lied.' There is a 'statistical correlation between higher doses of aluminum' in their data, showing that people who got more aluminum had higher rates of autism, ADHD, and other neurodevelopmental problems, and it should be retracted. If you remember back in COVID, the surgosphere study was 'completely laced with fraudulent data, and it was retracted.'

The conversation centers on the safety of glyphosate. Speaker 0 says, “I do not believe that glyphosate in Argentina is causing increases in cancer,” and adds, “You can drink a whole quart of it and it won't hurt you.” They even offer, “It's here. I'd be happy to actually,” and insist, “Not really? I know it wouldn't hurt me.” The other person resists, insisting that glyphosate is dangerous, and asks about drinking one glass, to which the response is, “I'm not an idiot,” followed by, “I know so.” The discussion touches on the claim that glyphosate is not dangerous to humans, while also noting that “People try to commit suicide, but then it fail fairly regularly,” implying a different perspective on the danger. The exchange continues with a push-pull about the reality of the risk, as the other participant asks for a direct interview about golden rice, and the response shifts to, “Interview me about golden rice. That's what I'm talking about.” The interaction ends with the statement that the interview is finished and a closing insult: “You're a complete jerk.” The overall exchange juxtaposes denial of cancer risk from glyphosate with provocative offers and counterpoints, culminating in a switch to a topic about golden rice and a dismissive closing remark.

According to the speaker, most vaccines have never been tested in a randomized, placebo-controlled trial to evaluate their safety. The speaker claims that vaccines contain aluminum compounds because many dead vaccines don't mount an immune response without them. The speaker alleges that in a Gardasil vaccine study, the placebo group received an aluminum adjuvant instead of a true placebo, resulting in similar side effect profiles between the active vaccine and placebo groups. The speaker asserts that Merck used a novel aluminum compound and that data suggests aluminum in vaccines is profoundly toxic. The speaker states that the only true randomized controlled trial involving a vaccine was conducted on sheep with blue tongue disease. The results allegedly showed that the aluminum in the vaccine was toxic, causing the sheep to become sick, unsociable, and, in some cases, die. The speaker concludes that the assumption that aluminum adjuvants in vaccines are safe is unfounded and has never been tested.

Speaker 0 frames the issue as 'the corruption of science' and the 'capture of the agencies' by pharmaceutical industries, stating the goal is to restore integrity and credibility to science. Speaker 1 cites a CDC internal study: 'black boys who got the vaccine on time had a two hundred and sixty percent greater chance of getting an autism diagnosis than children who waited.' He adds that 'The chief chief scientist on that, Doctor. William Thompson, the senior said vaccine safety science at CDC, was ordered to destroy that data. And then they published it without that fact.' Finally, he asserts, 'So, you know that story. And you know of hundreds of stories like that. It happens all the time. We are being lied to by these agencies, and we're gonna change that right now.'

Speaker 1 claims that no vaccines, including the COVID vaccine, have been properly tested. They assert that no childhood vaccine has undergone a placebo-controlled clinical trial of sufficient duration and power to assess its safety before being injected into millions of children in America. Speaker 1 states this is not just their opinion, but can be verified by anyone who examines the FDA website, specifically the package inserts and underlying clinical trial documents.

The speaker claims epidemiological studies are easily manipulated and that proper studies comparing vaccinated and unvaccinated groups are lacking, except for a CDC study in 1999. This CDC study, led by Thomas Verstraten, allegedly compared children who received the hepatitis vaccine within the first thirty days of life to those vaccinated later or not at all. The speaker asserts the study found a 1,135% elevated risk of autism in vaccinated children, which "shocked" researchers. The speaker alleges the CDC then kept the study secret and manipulated it through five iterations to bury the link.

The speaker claims that this is not conspiracy theory and cites a BMJ publication by Retzaf Levy, which describes a process in vaccine development: vaccines were trialed under one formulation, but when the decision was made to deploy them globally, the process was changed and the product injected to the rest of the world. The speaker asserts that changing the process requires new trials, yet the EMA asked for an additional trial of 250 people after the process change, and that data was never delivered. This is described as a “bait and switch,” asserted as crucial for understanding why trial data is of zero consequence to what’s seen in the field, implying that real-world outcomes do not match trial data and that the numbers from trials are a caricature of field performance. The speaker claims Pfizer had early data indicating what would happen and acted on that by acquiring cancer companies: $43,000,000,000 into the acquisition of C Gen and $2,260,000,000 to acquire Trillium Therapeutics. Trillium is described as focused on blood cancers with the CD147 marker (CD Adaptor 147) on them, a marker claimed to be known to be involved in COVID. The implication is that Pfizer is building an investment portfolio in cancer companies that would benefit from the consequences the speaker alleges they caused. In summary, the vaccines on the market are said to be not the same formulation as what was tested in clinical trials, labeling this a “bait and switch” and a fraud, and asserting that vaccine effectiveness numbers are not reliable because the products differ from trial formulations and because those numbers decay over time. The speaker alleges significant DNA contamination, stating that 10 out of 11 studies have found this, with the remaining studies allegedly constrained by financial conflicts. The claim is that consensus among real studies supports DNA contamination, with several studies through peer review, which the speaker notes is difficult for those papers to pass through peer review. It is claimed that five peer-reviewed studies not originally examining contamination found DNA in blood and tissue upon sleuthing. The speaker asserts that cancer is on the rise and that several papers report cancer post-vaccination, including neoplasms at the site of injection. The claim is that this situation cannot be dismissed as coincidence and is described as “liability free” and often mandated. The speaker posits that this may be the largest carcinogenic hit to the human population, with vaccines on childhood schedules and given to pregnant women, stating that “this has gone absolutely off the rails.”

We found that the FDA lied about a maternal rat study that was testing the safety of mandating a vaccine to pregnant women. In every litter, individual pups had horrible bone deformities. This signal was extremely prominent. Moderna submitted the rat study, as they were required to do. The FDA then lied about the study results by claiming there were no problems. It was a huge enterprise in lying.

The speaker claims the assertion that red meat causes cancer was based on a vote, not science. The speaker's guest, a former WHO panel member, states the panel used observational studies to show association, not causation. Of 800 studies examined, 780 were allegedly not used. Of the 18 studies that were considered, only half showed a risk. The guest concludes there is no valid demonstration of cause and effect. The speaker suggests this raises concerns about how global health policy is made.

Speaker 0 lays out a detailed critique of how the transition from process one to process two allegedly occurred, arguing that process one was deliberately structured to “cook the books” so that regulators would see nothing in their assays, while the real material of concern—DNA contaminants, including plasmids and RNA/DNA hybrids—would only be detectable in process two. Key points - The shift from process one to process two is alleged to be planned from the start. The assays used were designed “not to find things,” and the trial was set up in process one with the expectation that process two would ultimately be used, exposing a premeditated sequence of actions. - Ten nanogram limit and copy number. The ten nanogram figure is framed as a limited hangout: the real concern is molarity and copy number of DNA molecules, not weight. Naked-DNA half-lives are short, but lipid nanoparticles (LNPs) protect DNA, altering degradation and persistence. The origin of the 10 ng limit traces to Sheng Fowler and Keith Patten’s work, which emphasized copy number (molarity) rather than weight, particularly for small fragments and plasmids. The argument is that 10 ng can correspond to vastly different copy numbers depending on fragment size; smaller fragments dramatically increase copy number and potential integration ends. - Spike vs. CAN gene targeting. In process one, spike sequences are amplified, then RNA is generated via IVT, and residual DNA is monitored using a CAN gene target. The CAN assay is described as a decoy that would not detect post-amplification products; spike post-amplification would be abundant, but the CAN assay would show little or nothing. In process two, E. coli replication of the entire plasmid would introduce CAN sequences, yet regulators were still steered to look at CAN rather than spike, masking true residual DNA. - Assay design and regulatory deception. The EMA/EMAs documents and related papers show an RT-PCR setup that amplifies spike RNA to confirm expression while also using CAN primers that would not detect post-amplification plasmid content. A key accusation is that the regulators were given an assay that cannot detect the relevant post-amplification material, while an assay for spike exists but is not reported or used. - DNA vs. RNA measurement challenges. qPCR is argued to be ill-suited for this purpose due to fragmentation and the mismatch between input weight and actual molecule count. Fragmentation from DNase treatment is nonrandom: can (CAN) regions are hyper-fragmented, spike regions less so, causing disproportionate detectability depending on primer design and amplicon length. This yields underestimation of the true DNA content when relying on CAN-targeted PCR. - Enzymatic treatment and measurement implications. DNase I degrades CAN more efficiently than spike, particularly when DNA is in a DNA/RNA hybrid context post-IVT. Another enzyme (DNase XT) is claimed to better digest RNA-DNA hybrids, moving CT values for CAN and leaving spike detectable. This suggests the choice of enzymes was deliberate to obscure true residual DNA, while spike DNA remains more detectable under alternative assays. - Measurement methods and data interpretation. Fluorometry (e.g., PicoGreen or Ribogreen) is used to measure DNA or RNA doses, but crosstalk and fragmentation complicate interpretation. The speaker argues that fluorometry should be used in conjunction with RNase/DNase treatments and proper controls to distinguish DNA from RNA, and cautions that PCR-based extrapolations can massively overestimate or misrepresent actual DNA content due to fragmentation biases. - Consolidated claim. Across multiple studies and preparations, spike DNA is found at significantly higher levels than CAN DNA (e.g., a hundredfold difference in several datasets). The “can” assay is positioned as a decoy, while spike assays reveal the genuine DNA content and potential for integration, signaling intentional misdirection in regulator briefings. The speaker concludes that the “game of hide the ball” is ongoing: regulators have been misdirected to look for CAN DNA in process one, while the meaningful residual DNA relates to spike-containing sequences post-amplification—yet this is not consistently measured or reported. The overall thrust is that the design of assays and the choice of targets imply intentional deception to obscure true DNA contamination risks, particularly in the transition to process two.

Speaker 0 describes a study on the hepatitis B vaccine, stating it is loaded with mercury during the first thirty days of life and comparing infants who received it in that period to those who did not or who received it later. He claims that the relative risk of smoking a pack a day for twenty years leading to lung cancer is ten, with a figure of 11.35, and attributes this to Thimerosal. Speaker 1 asks if the claim is about Thimerosal, and Speaker 0 confirms, then recounts a story that motivated his involvement: a “secret meeting” held to avoid on-campus exposure to freedom of information requests. The meeting occurred at Simpson Wood, a remote Methodist retreat center on the Chattahoochee River in Norcross, Georgia. Over two days, 52 attendees included major vaccine companies, regulatory agencies (WHO, CDC, FDA, NIH, HHS), and leaders in academic vaccinology. Megan recorded the first day, and Speaker 0 says he obtained the transcripts in 2005, calling them horrific. He invites listeners to read them on the Children’s Health Events site to judge for themselves, arguing the transcripts reveal “panjarums of the American healthcare system” and that regulators claimed the science was bulletproof while suggesting vaccines cause autism. Speaker 1 notes that Speaker 0 has previously claimed the conference revealed that vaccines cause autism and that data should be buried, referencing a January 2011 Rolling Stone article and a Salon piece that later withdrew the article. He mentions an eighteen-month US Senate committee investigation that found allegations of CDC misconduct unsubstantiated and concluded there was no cover-up. Speaker 0 clarifies it was a two-year committee hearing led by Senator Burton at the Governmental Oversight Committee, and asserts that vaccines do cause autism, while encouraging listeners to research the science themselves rather than trust him or the organizations cited. Speaker 0 then attacks the credibility and funding of CDC, NIH, and the American Academy of Pediatrics, claiming they are “bought and paid for,” with statistics he cites: FDA is funded 45% by the pharmaceutical industry; the AAP allegedly gets 80% of its money from industry; and the CDC spends 4,900,000,000 of its 12,000,000,000 annual budget. Speaker 1 pushes back by noting that parents within these organizations vaccinate their own children against vaccines that include thimerosal, asking rhetorically whether they are willingly harming their children, and suggesting a broader government conspiracy. Speaker 0 then directs Speaker 1 to the movie Dopesick for further context, contrasting it with opioid prescriptions, and asserts that doctors treated patients and their own children with opioids because they believed FDA guidance. Overall, the dialogue centers on thimerosal in early vaccines, alleged hidden meetings and data suppression, controversial media coverage of vaccines-autism links, and critical claims about regulatory agency funding and conduct, culminating in comparisons to pharmaceutical and medical industry dynamics.

Despite it being treated as an obligation to do so, physicians reportedly do not know these facts. The speaker expresses strong frustration about the situation. The speaker cites a famous medical journal, the New England Journal of Medicine, describing a study of vaccine researchers and stating that “the 12.6 percent user rate” was reported, and that the paper claimed there was no problem with the vaccine based on that figure. Using that paper as a basis, the San Fujikawa Society or a similarly named organization promoted vaccination for pregnant women. However, the actual content of the data is described as follows: of 827 people, 700 were in the late stage of pregnancy, and 127 were in the early stage (first trimester). For the subgroup limited to those under 20 weeks’ gestation, i.e., the 127 individuals, the reported miscarriage rate was 82 percent. From this, the speaker argues that the vaccine is dangerous, given the result for the early-stage group. It is claimed that the data were hidden or obscured, and that the later report combined the late-pregnancy group of 700 with the early-pregnancy group of 127 to produce a 12.6 percent miscarriage rate, which was then published. The speaker concludes that even a major medical journal could be influenced by external financial pressures, resulting in biased reporting that supports the other side’s interests.

The speaker states that they believed Pfizer had two legal definitions for their jab for nefarious reasons, suspecting one would be used for FDA approval while the other, containing SV40, would be released to the public. This suspicion stems from the 1950s polio vaccine contamination with SV40. The speaker recounts how Dr. Ochsner tested the polio vaccine on his grandchildren, resulting in one death and one case of polio. Ochsner then alerted the "industrial military complex" to the problem. Dr. Bernice Eddy at the NIH discovered SV40 contamination in the polio vaccines but was silenced after revealing it. The speaker distrusted the COVID response due to this history and suspected Pfizer's use of the SV40 promoter. Kevin McKernan later tested expired vials and found SV40, suggesting a deliberate scheme to harm people who received the jab.

The speaker alleges that after receiving FDA Emergency Use Authorization for a vaccine produced via "process one," manufacturers switched to "process two." This new process allegedly introduced contaminants, including foreign DNA and SV40, a cancer-causing substance. The speaker connects this alleged change to a reported increase in aggressive cancers, particularly among young people. Referencing an NIH paper, the speaker claims SV40 is a known oncogenic DNA virus that induces cancers in laboratory animals. The speaker asserts Pfizer knew they were putting a carcinogen in process two. They speculate that this is the reason Pfizer redacted 800 pages of the manufacturing process, citing trade secrets.

The speaker states they searched for years for a pre-licensing safety trial of the 72 vaccine doses effectively mandated for American children. They claim that every other medication requires a safety trial comparing health outcomes in a placebo group versus a vaccine group before FDA licensing. The speaker assumed this was also done for vaccines. They state they found out that vaccines were exempt from this requirement.

The speaker questions the safety of glyphosate, the key ingredient in Roundup, despite claims from Bayer that it does not cause cancer. They cite 180,000 lawsuits against Bayer, resulting in over $12 billion in damages, and Bayer's efforts to prevent future glyphosate-related cancer lawsuits. Roundup Ready crops, genetically engineered to resist glyphosate, led to a surge in its use, with approximately 60% of crops now treated with it. The speaker highlights a letter from members of Congress arguing against glyphosate overregulation, suggesting that without it, widespread hunger will occur. They point out that some signatories, like Deb Fischer and Chuck Grassley, are major recipients of funding from big agriculture and biotech companies like Bayer, DuPont, and Dow. The speaker implies that these contributions influence their support for glyphosate.

The speaker asserts that COVID-19 shots do more than affect the immune system; they can damage the brain and worsen mental health. They claim a wave of studies shows sharp increases in various strokes: ischemic strokes up to 44%, hemorrhagic strokes up to 50%, and transient ischemic attacks (mini strokes) up to 67%. They also report increases in neurological and autoimmune conditions, including myasthenia gravis up 71% and Alzheimer’s disease up 22%. Cognitive impairment is claimed to have risen by nearly 138%, while depression is up 68%, anxiety disorders up 44%, and sleep disorders up 93%. The speaker links all of these increases to “toxic spike protein accumulation and persistence in the brain.” The speaker states this is not a conspiracy theory and cites what they describe as documented peer‑reviewed research and studies by experts. They name epidemiologist Nicholas Holcher, who allegedly says that using mRNA to hijack cells in various organ systems to produce a highly toxic spike protein that persists in the body for months or years was “one of the worst ideas in medical history.” The speaker then asks, “So what can you do?” as a transition to presumably recommendations or actions, though no specific actions are listed in the provided segment.

According to the speaker, vaccines have never been tested in a randomized, placebo-controlled trial to evaluate their safety. The speaker claims that vaccines contain aluminum compounds because many dead vaccines don't mount an immune response without them. The speaker alleges that in a Gardasil vaccine study, the placebo group received an aluminum adjuvant instead of a true placebo, so the side effect profiles of the active vaccine and placebo groups were the same. The speaker asserts that Merck used a novel aluminum compound and that data shows aluminum in vaccines is toxic. The speaker states that the only completely randomized controlled trial was on sheep using a vaccine for blue tongue disease. The speaker claims the aluminum was toxic, the sheep became sick, their behavior changed, and many died compared to the placebo group. The speaker concludes that the presumption that aluminum as an adjuvant is safe is unfounded and has never been tested.

Speaker 1 states that no vaccines, including the COVID vaccine, have been properly tested. They claim that no childhood vaccine has undergone a placebo-controlled clinical trial of sufficient duration and power to assess its safety before being injected into millions of children in America. Speaker 1 asserts this is not an opinion, but can be verified by anyone reviewing package inserts and clinical trial documents on the FDA website.

The speaker claims previous studies indicating no link between certain factors and specific outcomes were flawed. They allege researchers eliminated older children from the data, stratified the data improperly, and used other "tricks." The speaker states that external literature shows over 100 studies indicating a link. They announce plans to conduct new observational, retrospective, and epidemiological studies, as originally recommended by the Institute of Medicine, using publicly available databases. They characterize this new approach as "real science."

The speaker believes COVID vaccine programs should be stopped. They are astounded by the number of papers critical of the vaccine or showing negative effects. The speaker claims a group of researchers funded by Pfizer and the NIH bullies editors to retract papers with negative findings about the vaccine. They assert the number of retractions is appalling. According to the speaker, in one instance where an editor resisted, Nature Springer bought the journal and retracted the paper. The speaker states that this is what they have been dealing with.