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Speaker 1 claims that no vaccines, including the COVID vaccine, have been properly tested. They assert that no childhood vaccine has undergone a placebo-controlled clinical trial of sufficient duration and power to assess its safety before being injected into millions of children in America. Speaker 1 states this is not just their opinion, but can be verified by anyone who examines the FDA website, specifically the package inserts and underlying clinical trial documents.

Vaccines don't cause autism. The science is clear. Vaccines don't cause autism. Vaccines do not cause autism. I do not deny that we need to do more about autism, but it has nothing to do with vaccines. We have thoroughly debunked any association between autism and these vaccines. Robert, it is nearly consensus in the scientific community that there's no link there. To deny a mountain of scientific evidence, which has already taught us that the combination of measles, mumps, rubella, or MMR vaccine doesn't cause autism, Vimerosal, an ethylmercury containing preservative that wasn't a number of vaccines doesn't cause autism, and that too many vaccines given too soon, if you will, doesn't also cause autism. We know that the schedule is safe. Are there peer reviewed scientific reports that indicate a link between No. Between vaccines and autism? No. Not only is there not a peer reviewed work, this is probably the most studied public health issue involving children. Vaccines are really the one thing we have looked at as causing autism. The Institutes of Medicine, the Centers for Disease Control have repeatedly investigated this. Vaccines do not cause autism. We don't need more research. At some point, enough is enough. It's fine to continue to collect data, but at some point, you have to take note for an answer. We're not sure what causes autism, but we know that vaccines do not. Mountains of evidence. No, you know, this has been looked at extensively. Nothing's been more studied in the world than this connection between vaccines and autism. We'd heard it. We've heard it for decades. You know, actually almost a century now, if you want to get into it. This has been the battle cry of the pharmaceutical industry and every shill that works for them. But whether you know it or not all the way back in 2020 for those of you that were watching then we actually disproved this myth right then. Debunked it with a lawsuit where we went at the CDC and said really if the head of your page on the CDC website says vaccines plural meaning all vaccines do not cause us to do we have that original website. This is what it said: vaccines do not cause autism. There it is. All vaccines doesn't say one of them or two of them all vaccines by the plural s at the end of vaccines. If vaccines do not cause autism will you please provide us with all of the evidence and studies that show that vaccines don't cause autism. Send us that evidence. Well they didn't and we sued them and we went to court. Back in 2020, we won the case. Here it looks like in the document. They gave us the list. It's actually 20 studies. 20 total studies make up the entire list of what they look to when they say that these childhood vaccines, the five, and the cumulative effects of them given in the first six months of life, do not cause autism. The first one is an MMR study. The second one an MMR and a DTaP study. The next ones are MMR, these four are MMR and Thimerosal studies. Then the next all the way through to 20 are all just Thimerosal studies. Lastly, we have one antigen study. Of the 20 studies, the first MMR studies are not in the first six months of life; Thimerosal studies show none of the vaccines in the first six months of life had Thimerosal. There was only one study relevant to the first six months of life, the IOM review of the DTaP vaccine, and it said there are no studies that prove or disprove the association with autism. Therefore, that was the only one that was relevant to the first six months of life, and it proved that they had no answers. And so for everyone that's ever sent Mountain of Evidence, that's been a lie. We won in court. It's a lie. You can take that to the bank. And actually just months after winning that lawsuit, that was in May, by August they pulled down the statement vaccines do not cause autism. We celebrated it but five months later it went back up and we've been stuck there with this propaganda statement that have no basis in science up until last night when this happened to the website. Let's see the new page. Here it is. It now says autism and vaccines and right under that it has the key points. So we read those key points. The claim vaccines do not cause autism is not an evidence-based claim because studies have not ruled out the possibility that infant vaccines cause autism, meaning those vaccines in the first six months of life. Meaning the IOM lawsuit that proved that. Studies supporting a link have been ignored by health authorities. HHS has launched a comprehensive assessment of the causes of autism, including investigations on plausible biologic mechanisms and potential causal links. It does have an explanatory statement I want to read right now. It says this about why you will still see it with an asterisk the header vaccines do not cause autism has not been completely removed due to an agreement with the chair of the U.S. Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee that it would remain on the CDC website. Apparently, this was that backroom deal that was made with Senator Cassidy, of course, when Robert Kennedy Jr. was up there. But now you can see on the page it is clear we are making the statement or it's being made by the CDC that this is not a scientific statement and so ultimately this is a massive change. I tweeted out about it today and to every parent of an autistic child that's been out there. For every one of you that did interviews, whether in the film Vaxxed or when we toured the nation and for everyone that's ever been gaslit, the days of gaslighting are over. We are now moving into science-based, evidence-based statements on the CDC website. It's a beautiful day.

The speaker claims that measles was not deadly in the US after the early 1900s, citing improved nutrition and later, Vitamin A treatment. They believe contracting measles can be beneficial, leading to increased resistance to certain diseases. Regarding an outbreak in Samoa, the speaker alleges that a measles vaccine caused deaths, not measles itself, and that they did not influence policy there. They maintain that vaccines cause autism, referencing a CDC study on the hepatitis B vaccine that showed an elevated risk. They accuse the CDC of fraud, claiming a scientist named Paul Thornson produced a study to create the illusion that vaccines don't cause autism, stole money, and is now a fugitive. The speaker states there are hundreds of studies linking vaccines to autism and neurological injuries. They accuse the CDC of being controlled by the pharmaceutical industry.

Speaker 1 states they would not give their children the measles, mumps vaccine, claiming that while many used to die from these diseases, by 1964, only 300-400 Americans died, mostly malnourished children. They claim the World Health Organization says vitamin A is a cure for measles and that contracting measles as a child leads to greater resistance to cancers, atopic diseases, allergies, and heart disease. Speaker 1 denies causing a measles outbreak in Samoa, stating the prime minister had already banned the vaccine after deaths, and that the deaths were due to a bad vaccine from Australia given to people who already had measles. They maintain that autism is caused by vaccines, citing a CDC study that showed a 1350% elevated risk for autism among children who received the hepatitis B vaccine in their first 30 days. They allege that studies claiming vaccines don't cause autism are fraudulent, citing a fugitive scientist, Paul Thornson, and that the CDC is dishonest and controlled by the pharmaceutical industry. They reference their book, "Let the Science Speak," which they claim contains 1,400 references and over 400 studies linking autism and neurological injuries to vaccines.

Speaker 0 asserts that there is no safe vaccine on the childhood schedule and labels themselves an anti-vaxxer because no vaccine has been properly tested for safety. They state that, in the book Vax Facts, you are more likely to die from the vaccine than from the disease for which there is a vaccine, and that this is true for every single vaccine on the childhood schedule. They acknowledge that death from the vaccine is still a death and “super rare,” but claim you are much more likely to die from the vaccine. They ask which do you want: a greater chance of dying from the vaccine or a lesser chance of dying from the disease, noting that for many of these diseases, the risk is zero.

Speaker 1 claims that no vaccines, including the COVID vaccine, have been properly tested. They assert that no childhood vaccine has undergone a placebo-controlled clinical trial of sufficient duration and power to assess its safety before being injected into millions of children in America. Speaker 1 states this is not just their opinion, but can be verified by anyone who examines the FDA website, specifically the package inserts and underlying clinical trial documents.

Speaker 0 and Speaker 1 engage in a discussion about allegations surrounding vaccines. Speaker 0 asserts that, up until about a year and a half ago, he would not have endorsed such views, but now, after considering what is happening, he feels compelled to admit that colleagues and friends who have claimed this is genocide may be right. He states, “There is no other agenda. There is no other explanation,” insisting that there can be no alternative interpretation for current events. He contends that these vaccines, described as gene-based vaccines, are not needed because we are not dealing with a killer virus that is destroying mankind, and that anyone who says otherwise is lying to one’s face. He further claims that the so-called vaccines could never have protected against infection because the antibodies are not present when they are needed. He adds that resistance and immunity to these viruses is not antibody-based but is based on T cells that are present in every human being. He then makes a grave assertion about the vaccines, describing them as “the most terrible instruments that have ever been introduced into the human body to destroy humans,” asserting that they affect “the mind, going to the heart, going to the organs and to the entire body,” and concluding that these vaccines are going to destroy mankind. Speaker 1 frames the discussion by highlighting that Michael Yiddin described the situation as genocide and criminal, and asks Speaker 0 to explain, noting that Speaker 0 had stated the same views. The exchange centers on whether the situation constitutes genocide and criminal acts, with Speaker 0 acknowledging the possibility but using strong language to emphasize his conclusions about the vaccines’ necessity, mechanism of immunity, and potential harm. Overall, the dialogue presents a trajectory from initial reluctance to endorsement of genocide claims, driven by claims that gene-based vaccines are unnecessary, not protective against infection due to lack of antibodies, rely on T-cell-based immunity, and may cause widespread harm to the mind, heart, and other organs, culminating in the assertion that such vaccines could destroy mankind.

The speaker discusses the complexity of vaccines and the correlation with autism rates. They compare the number of vaccines in the US to other countries and question why certain vaccines are not widely used. They criticize limited studies on vaccine safety and call for more thorough research. The conversation emphasizes the importance of understanding the details and not dismissing concerns about vaccine safety. The speaker expresses frustration with those who do not thoroughly investigate the issue. Ultimately, the focus is on finding ways to help children without causing unnecessary conflict.

Vaccines cause autism, according to the speaker. They claim that a graph showing the percentage of vaccinated children versus the age of their first vaccination indicates a link between the MMR vaccine and autism. The speaker also suggests that there is a significant increase in autism incidence among children who receive the vaccine between 12 and 18 months compared to those who receive it after three years. They argue that the CDC refuses to conduct a vaccinated versus unvaccinated study because the results would reveal a high risk. The speaker questions the credibility of a study used to dismiss the vaccine-autism connection and calls for changes in vaccination policies.

Speaker 1 claims that measles was not deadly for healthy children in the past, citing vitamin A as a cure and suggesting that contracting measles can be beneficial for long-term health. Speaker 1 disputes the claim that they caused a measles outbreak in Samoa, stating that a measles vaccine from Australia caused deaths, not measles itself. They allege the prime minister had already banned the vaccine due to deaths, including family members. Speaker 1 asserts that vaccines cause autism, referencing a CDC study on the hepatitis B vaccine that showed an elevated risk of autism. They also claim that studies disproving this link are fraudulent, citing a fugitive scientist, Paul Thornson, and their own book with 1,400 references linking vaccines to neurological injuries. They accuse the CDC of being controlled by the pharmaceutical industry and spreading propaganda.

The speaker discusses the misconception that vaccines are always beneficial and highlights the lower under-five mortality rates in other countries with fewer vaccines. They question why certain vaccines, like flu and varicella, are not widely adopted in other countries and raise concerns about the correlation between vaccines and autism. Another speaker emphasizes the need for an open debate on this topic and criticizes the limited number of vaccines and ingredients studied in relation to autism. They express frustration with doctors who dismiss the potential link between vaccines and autism without thoroughly examining the research. The speaker urges for a more collaborative approach to help children and criticizes those who antagonize the medical community.

The speakers exchange pointed claims about vaccination status and social policy. Speaker 0 asserts that vaccinated people are the problem and that it is the unvaccinated who are responsible. Speaker 1 counters with a stance that the unvaccinated should be shamed and blamed, and asserts that it is time to start blaming the unvaccinated, not ordinary people. The dialogue emphasizes distrust of the unvaccinated, with Speaker 0 and Speaker 1 associating the unvaccinated with negative behavior and calling for punitive approaches. Speaker 1 argues that the unvaccinated include children and people acting like children, and contends that it’s time to stop tolerating “the idiots in this country” and to mandate vaccination. The speakers discuss shaming the unvaccinated and refuse to call them stupid or silly by implication, while also stating that those who are not vaccinated will “end up paying the price” and that the unvaccinated should be taxed or pay more for health care. Speaker 0 suggests treating the choice to remain unvaccinated like driving while intoxicated, implying it should be addressed with similar seriousness. Speaker 1 claims that only the unvaccinated are dying and condemns misinformation, urging shaming and shunning of those who spread it, calling for turning people away. The dialogue advocates exclusion for the unvaccinated: Speaker 0 says unvaccinated individuals should be denied entry to offices or places of business, and Speaker 1 argues that if you don’t get vaccinated, you can’t come to work. The phrase “Ew. Screw your freedom” expresses a rejection of individual freedom in this context. Speaker 1 contends that the unvaccinated have put everyone in a bad position and asserts that it is not a good place. The conversation ends with a provocative statement about freedom and power, declaring that “Freedom is a fragile thing, and it's never more than one generation away from extinction.” The closing lines add, “Ice of man come not from the generosity of the state, but from the hand of God. They were wrong. Question everything.”

Speaker 0 describes a study on the hepatitis B vaccine, stating it is loaded with mercury during the first thirty days of life and comparing infants who received it in that period to those who did not or who received it later. He claims that the relative risk of smoking a pack a day for twenty years leading to lung cancer is ten, with a figure of 11.35, and attributes this to Thimerosal. Speaker 1 asks if the claim is about Thimerosal, and Speaker 0 confirms, then recounts a story that motivated his involvement: a “secret meeting” held to avoid on-campus exposure to freedom of information requests. The meeting occurred at Simpson Wood, a remote Methodist retreat center on the Chattahoochee River in Norcross, Georgia. Over two days, 52 attendees included major vaccine companies, regulatory agencies (WHO, CDC, FDA, NIH, HHS), and leaders in academic vaccinology. Megan recorded the first day, and Speaker 0 says he obtained the transcripts in 2005, calling them horrific. He invites listeners to read them on the Children’s Health Events site to judge for themselves, arguing the transcripts reveal “panjarums of the American healthcare system” and that regulators claimed the science was bulletproof while suggesting vaccines cause autism. Speaker 1 notes that Speaker 0 has previously claimed the conference revealed that vaccines cause autism and that data should be buried, referencing a January 2011 Rolling Stone article and a Salon piece that later withdrew the article. He mentions an eighteen-month US Senate committee investigation that found allegations of CDC misconduct unsubstantiated and concluded there was no cover-up. Speaker 0 clarifies it was a two-year committee hearing led by Senator Burton at the Governmental Oversight Committee, and asserts that vaccines do cause autism, while encouraging listeners to research the science themselves rather than trust him or the organizations cited. Speaker 0 then attacks the credibility and funding of CDC, NIH, and the American Academy of Pediatrics, claiming they are “bought and paid for,” with statistics he cites: FDA is funded 45% by the pharmaceutical industry; the AAP allegedly gets 80% of its money from industry; and the CDC spends 4,900,000,000 of its 12,000,000,000 annual budget. Speaker 1 pushes back by noting that parents within these organizations vaccinate their own children against vaccines that include thimerosal, asking rhetorically whether they are willingly harming their children, and suggesting a broader government conspiracy. Speaker 0 then directs Speaker 1 to the movie Dopesick for further context, contrasting it with opioid prescriptions, and asserts that doctors treated patients and their own children with opioids because they believed FDA guidance. Overall, the dialogue centers on thimerosal in early vaccines, alleged hidden meetings and data suppression, controversial media coverage of vaccines-autism links, and critical claims about regulatory agency funding and conduct, culminating in comparisons to pharmaceutical and medical industry dynamics.

Autism is caused by vaccines, according to the speaker. The CDC's VirTrak study from 1989 showed a 1350% elevated risk for autism among children who received the hepatitis B vaccine in their first 30 days. A series of 13 studies were allegedly done by people paid by the CDC to create the illusion that vaccines don't cause autism. The chief scientist, Paul Thornsen, is a fugitive wanted by Interpol for stealing millions from the CDC that he claimed to use for the study. His study is considered fraudulent but has not been retracted. The speaker claims there are hundreds of studies linking autism and neurological injuries to vaccines, citing a book with 1,400 references and over 400 studies. The speaker believes the CDC is a dishonest organization owned by the pharmaceutical industry and promotes propaganda that vaccines don't cause autism.

World governments have harmed millions without apology. The speaker believes vaccines cause autism, but mainstream media won't discuss it. They gathered data from 10,000 parents showing a link between vaccines and autism, ADHD, and other health issues. More shots lead to poorer health in children.

The speaker claims colored vaccines are dangerous, with no clinical benefit and over 10,000,000 deaths worldwide. They suggest avoiding vaccination altogether, citing studies showing unvaccinated kids are healthier. They criticize censorship by the government and medical boards, leading to job loss and license revocation for speaking out against the narrative. The medical journals are also deemed corrupt. Speaker 1 mentions not every batch causes harm, as they themselves took a few shots without issue.

Speaker 0 argues that invoking “the science says this because CDC says it, because my doctor says it, or because FDA says it” is a “logical fallacy” and an “appeals to authority.” “You cannot show me a study that shows that the flu vaccine actually efforts more problems than it causes.” He says he can show many studies, “It’s in the Dear Sanjay Gupta letter.” “Show me that study, then I will walk away from that issue.” Speaker 1 concedes the CDC isn’t perfect but notes, “There are hundreds of millions of people who have gotten these vaccine vaccines who are perfectly healthy. Perfectly healthy in part thanks to the vaccines.” “The vaccines are not all bad.” and adds, “Just because we have suspicions about some of them, and in particular, the COVID vaccine, it doesn't mean we can and because you started this, Bobby, by saying, I am not anti vaxx.” Speaker 0 asks for “a scientific study for each vaccine that shows that this vaccine is averting for harm and it's causing.” Speaker 1 says, “They say the studies show no linkage of harm.” The exchange ends: “Let's advance the discussion. Okay?”

Speaker 1 states that no vaccines, including the COVID vaccine, have been properly tested. They claim that no childhood vaccine has undergone a placebo-controlled clinical trial of sufficient duration and power to assess its safety before being injected into millions of children in America. Speaker 1 asserts this is not an opinion, but can be verified by anyone reviewing package inserts and clinical trial documents on the FDA website.

The speaker states they would not give their children the measles, mumps vaccine, claiming that measles was deadly in the early 1900s, but is now easily survivable, especially with Vitamin A. They claim studies show that contracting measles can make children healthier and more resistant to diseases later in life. The speaker denies causing a measles outbreak in Samoa, stating the Prime Minister had already banned the vaccine after deaths, and that people died from a bad vaccine imported from Australia, not measles. The speaker asserts that vaccines cause autism, citing a CDC study that showed an elevated risk of autism in children who received the hepatitis B vaccine within their first 30 days. They claim that studies disproving this link were fraudulent, conducted by "biostitutes" paid by the CDC, and that the lead scientist, Paul Thorensen, is a fugitive wanted for stealing money. The speaker claims there are hundreds of studies linking vaccines to autism and neurological injuries.

The speaker is questioned about his stance on childhood vaccines, with many scientific and medical organizations disagreeing with him. The audience asks how they can help him align with science. The speaker clarifies that he is not anti-vaccine, but believes vaccines should undergo safety testing like other medicines. He criticizes the lack of prelicensing placebo-controlled trials for vaccines and cites examples of potential risks and lack of long-term studies. The other speaker argues that there is evidence of vaccines preventing diseases and highlights the importance of distinguishing between association and causation. The speaker emphasizes the need for good science and questions the trustworthiness of pharmaceutical companies. The conversation ends with a discussion about the speaker's family not supporting his views on vaccines.

Speaker 0 suggests the increase in autism diagnoses is due to over-diagnosis, with children now receiving multiple diagnoses for what was once considered normal behavior, and that autism diagnoses are currently fashionable. Speaker 1 refutes this, calling it nonsense and an industry-driven myth. They claim numerous studies in reputable journals confirm a real autism epidemic. If it were simply better diagnosis, older people would also be diagnosed, but the epidemic is specific to those born after 1989. Speaker 1, age 71, states they have never seen someone their age with profound autism, characterized by nonverbal communication, lack of toilet training, head banging, and stimming. The speaker questions why, if it weren't an epidemic, it would only affect a single generation.

Speaker 0 raises a concern about the vaccine, asking why every new paper or study seems to claim the vaccine is responsible for a new problem. The question posed is whether the vaccine is really responsible for every negative outcome discussed in the literature, noting rises in cancers and cognitive decline. The speaker questions the blanket attribution of all adverse effects to the vaccine. Speaker 1 responds by suggesting that the world’s population has been poisoned, stating that the protein was devised in the Chinese security lab in Wuhan, China. The speaker claims it is not a natural protein and is not supposed to be in the body. They assert that one can obtain spike protein from having the infection, which almost everyone has had, and from taking the vaccine. The speaker contends that “it’s almost as if we’ve all been poisoned.” They further claim that the spike protein stays in the body and causes disease, listing several specific adverse outcomes: heart disease, neurologic disease, autoimmunity, blood clots, and maybe even cancer.

The speaker states they would not give their children the measles, mumps vaccine, claiming that measles was only deadly in the early 1900s due to malnutrition. They allege vitamin A is now a cure and that contracting measles can make children healthier, more resistant to diseases like cancer and heart disease. Addressing an incident in Samoa, the speaker denies convincing people to avoid the measles vaccine, asserting a ban was already in place after deaths caused by a bad vaccine imported from Australia. They claim no one died from measles itself, but from the vaccine. The speaker maintains that vaccines cause autism, citing a CDC study that showed an elevated risk of autism in children who received the hepatitis B vaccine. They allege that studies disproving this link were fraudulent, conducted by "biostitutes" paid by the CDC, and that the lead scientist is now a fugitive wanted for embezzlement. The speaker claims there are hundreds of studies linking vaccines to autism and neurological injuries.

The speaker claims there's a simple solution to an unspecified problem: stop vaccinating. They allege that vaccine information sheets are propaganda and that the risk of serious adverse events is about one in twenty, not one in a million. The speaker states that the cause of autism is known, contrary to common belief. They claim there are hundreds of studies showing how toxins can cause autism and that aluminum, in particular, creates massive brain inflammation. The speaker suggests that if people stop vaccinating, eat organic food, and avoid Tylenol, they will be almost guaranteed healthy children.

Exhibit 22 is an excerpt from the IOM's report discussing whether DTaP or TDaP cause autism. The IOM concluded that there is inadequate evidence to determine a causal relationship. Speaker 1 points out that there are no studies showing that vaccines cause autism, except for one study by Guyer and Guyer, who lack legitimacy. They emphasize the need for a proper study involving controlled administration of vaccines. Speaker 1, as a physician, cannot definitively say vaccines do not cause autism, but they believe they do not. Speaker 0 questions if it is appropriate to make that claim without scientific evidence. Speaker 1 argues that they prioritize the child's health and are willing to say vaccines do not cause autism. The IOM did not review if DTaP causes leprosy.