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One speaker recounts that he did not like Bibi Netanyahu, describing Netanyahu as a destructive force and saying he was appalled by what was happening in Gaza, and that Netanyahu was using the United States to prosecute wars for the benefit of his country, which he called shameful and embarrassing and bad for the United States, a view he resented. He also notes that he didn’t hate Netanyahu. After that speech, there was a sharp backlash against Charlie Kirk and, to a lesser extent, the speaker, with Kirk having about $100 million in donors and being heavily dependent on them because his project was nonprofit. They went after him and tormented him, while a small, very intense group offended by the speech tormented Charlie Kirk until the day he died.

Charlie Kirk's interview with Megyn Kelly is highlighted, showing him fed up with attacks. 'However, Megan, you're hitting on something very potent and important.' He continues, 'I don't wanna judge an entire group because there's been many people in the Paris World that have been sweet, kind, nuanced, Charlie.' 'I love Israel. I want Israel to win.' But he adds, 'But my moral character is now being put into question, Megan.' He says attacks come from 'the people that are attacking me are in a hyperparanoid state because they're at war.' He invites viewers: 'If you too, just like Charlie, are starting to wake up and notice and you really wanna understand this animal that is Israel, swing over to Ian Carroll's YouTube channel and check out the documentary we just pre produced called creating Israel.' 'It's the perfect icebreaker,' and asks, 'Why is that America? Keep asking those questions.'

Speaker 1 questions the letter's truth; Speaker 2 confirms, "Yeah. I mean, it's it's real." They reference Nick Fuentes claiming Israel killed Charlie and mention "the call, like, Israel called him and told him to to to." Speaker 2 summarizes Charlie's Israel stance as nuanced: "he wanted people who controlled The Holy Land to be civilized people" and "didn't want it to be in the hands of Islam," preferring "a civilized group ... friendly to the West" over hostile Muslim nations. He was frustrated at being unable to criticize Israel without being labeled an anti Semitic, and had vehement disagreements about how the war was prosecuted and messaged; he wanted it to be over and saw more freedom to criticize America than Israel. "Even Tucker Carlson" noted Charlie Kirk's anti Semitic labeling; "BB's comments" were odd; he hosted critics like Dave Smith and recognized that "young people were much more Israeli skeptic," arguing that silencing debate would be a "huge disservice to the conservative movement."

"Is all over the country, specifically Yale and Columbia. They're getting shut down and overrun by these anti Jew protesters, these pro Gaza protesters, these terrorist sympathizers." "The Democrat party is being radio silent on this." "in the case of Bill Hanna Omar, her actual daughter out there standing in the picket line and protesting us." "It's disgusting, they should be calling it out." "We're pro Israel. We're a pro Jewish people. We're pro America." "they're supporting this Death to America chant by letting this continue on." "Republicans are pro Israel. We're pro America, and we're pro protecting Jewish citizens not only in Israel, but across the world, even here in America."

Megan Kelly and Charlie Kirk frame themselves as ardent defenders of Israel, urging caution against conflating critique with anti-Semitism. They argue that some in the pro-Israel camp punish mild pushback, harming credibility as they face online harassment and accusations of anti-Semitism, including Epstein/Mossad speculation. They cite a culture of hyperparanoia and insist they are Americans first. Megan recalls a Piers Morgan segment: she said 'the photos of the starving children out of Gaza' and 'they're manipulated, and they're masters of propaganda' and 'it's Hamas,' and that she is skeptical of taking those images at face value. They warn Israel risks losing standing with allies as support shifts: 'GOP in June 2024, 76%. Now 71%'; 'Dems in October 2023, 36%. Now it's at eight'; 'Independents ...(47%). Now it's 25%.' They defend hosting diverse voices—'you have no right to come on this show and demand a debate with me'.

Speakers Megan and Charlie Kirk frame themselves as Israel supporters defending Israel's right to defend itself and fighting campus anti-Semitism. They lament that some in the pro-Israel camp label any mild pushback as anti-Semitic, which they say undermines credibility and unity. They recount being attacked online and in media after nuanced takes, including Epstein/Mossad speculation; they insist discussing such possibilities should be allowed and that labeling anyone raising questions as anti-Semitic is divisive. They contrast an American-first stance with global opinion, noting that support for Israel's Gaza actions has fallen among Democrats (from 36% in Oct 2023 to 8%), independents (47% to 25%), and Republicans (76% to 71%). They discuss a Piers Morgan interview where nuance about Gaza images was criticized; they argue that Israel’s actions are eroding moral standing even among close allies. They pledge to continue honest coverage and push back against purity-tests.

Megan Kelly and Charlie Kirk discuss backlash for defending Israel while resisting criticisms, arguing that "some in the pro Israel camp are so knee jerk about calling you anti Semitic or getting deeply offended if you say anything that doesn't align with their narrative that it undermines their own cause." They challenge antisemitism accusations tied to Epstein/Mossad speculation, saying, "What the hell? That's such bullshit." They insist "We are Americans first, period. End of story" against a "sea of Islamic totalitarianism." They warn that Israel has "made itself the villain of the world" and note Democrats have turned. They cite polling: "GOP in June 2024, 76%... Now 71%... Dems in October 2023, 36%. Now it's at eight." They add, "the more you attack our moral character, the actually the more we're gonna double down," and describe Gaza imagery as propaganda: "they're manipulated and they're masters of propaganda."

"If Bibi Netanyahu, if he does something I don't like and if I criticize it, am I, like, a bad Christian? Absolutely not." "What I find strange is that we're able to criticize the American government sometimes in the Christian world with more freedom than the Israeli government." "To be pro Israel means you believe in the nation of Israel Mhmm. Not necessarily the government of Israel." "When you when Joe Biden was president, you and I were what we loved America, but we detested our government." "If they challenge a foreign government, which is what happens so often. Right. Like you're a bad Christian if you have a question about a foreign government." "Right. That creates backlash that I don't think people understand."

"If Bibi Netanyahu, if he does something I don't like and if I criticize it, am I, like, a bad Christian? Absolutely not." "What I find strange is that we're able to criticize the American government sometimes in the Christian world with more freedom than the Israeli government." "To be pro Israel means you believe in the nation of Israel Mhmm. Not necessarily the government of Israel." "When you when Joe Biden was president, you and I were what we loved America, but we detested our government. And those two those two things beautifully coexisted." "Exactly. And what they don't want is they don't wanna be called bad Christians Mhmm." "If they challenge a foreign government, which is what happens so often. Right. Like you're a bad Christian if you have a question about a foreign government." "Right. That creates backlash that I don't think people understand."

"Presidential campaigns do shape how a party thinks about questions more than midterms, and I think somebody's gonna stand up running for president in both political parties and say, I don't think we should send one more dollar to Israel. I don't think they've been good allies. I don't think they've been good friends. And if someone makes that argument, how do you think they'll be perceived in the Republican Party following the research you did on Kirk's own evolution?" "I think it's gonna be really hard to change young people's minds." "a generation of people who, for a really wide variety of reasons, I think, are very, very hostile to this to the Israeli government, really dislike what they're doing." "the truism in American politics that ultimately in elections, really, nobody cares about foreign policy."

Speaker 0: "We're just gonna try to we're we're gonna just stamp out everything type type of practice, but it goes to the point where if, for example, if I I have less ability sometimes online to criticize the Israeli government about backlash than actual Israelis do. And that's really, really weird, isn't it, Megan?" Speaker 1: "That's not right. Wrong headed." He says he faced blowback after saying, "Mossad, possibilities with Epstein," a comment he stands by, and that he "reported what Alan Dershowitz has said as his lawyer." He writes, "He says, I think he would have told me. He didn't say he had any of those connections. I hear all that. That doesn't mean it's not true." "I think all these things should be explored." "It's one of the many things that should be explored around Epstein." He finishes, "But saying that and also saying he might be a US asset, etcetera, doesn't make you antisemitic."

"And that suits the Israelis just fine." "And if you're wondering why there's an awful lot of lunatic antisemitic comment about Israel online, you have to wonder how much of that is organic." "But how much of it is not organic at all?" "How much of that is being ginned up on purpose to make legitimate questions about the US government's relationship with the government of Israel seem like crackpot stuff, like hate, like David Duke level lunacy?" "Probably some because it serves their interest." "And so the true shame here, the actual villain in the story is the leadership of The United States that is putting up with serial humiliation for decades." "You'd think every country would act that way, and most do." "And for what reason? So if there's someone to be mad at, it's our leaders."

Some people believe that disagreeing with Israel is antisemitic, which is seen as comparable to calling someone racist simply for disagreeing with them. There's a concern that constantly accusing people of hating Jews could lead to increased disdain towards Jewish people. Similarly, excessive focus on race may exacerbate racism. Canceling someone like Tucker Carlson for alleged antisemitism could increase antisemitism by association. The binary view that not passionately discussing Israel equates to being a hater is potentially destructive. A balanced approach is needed: rejecting Jew-hate while avoiding labeling everyone who critiques the Netanyahu government as antisemitic. The speakers express a desire to talk about Israel less.

Speaker 0 expresses that "The behavior by a lot, both privately and publicly, are pushing people like you and me away" and that he is accused of being an anti-Semite despite "I honor the Shabbat, literally the Jewish Sabbath." He notes online backlash, "thousands of tweets and text messages," and that his "moral character is now being put into question" for supporting Israel. Speaker 1 agrees the treatment is unfair, saying "Dave Smith isn't allowed to criticize Israel" and that "the Israeli side was overrepresented." They discuss Americans first, resisting accusations, and the difficulty of criticizing the Israeli government online. They reference Epstein's controversial topic and say they hosted a debate giving "equal time to Josh Hammer, equal time to a pro Israel advocate." They observe a "hyperparanoid state" online and wonder if patterns resemble "nineteen thirties Germany."

"We're just gonna try to we're we're gonna just stamp out everything type type of practice, but it goes to the point where if, for example, if I I have less ability sometimes online to criticize the Israeli government about backlash than actual Israelis do. And that's really, really weird, isn't it, Megan?" "That's not right. Wrong headed." "I So got some blowback after saying Mossad possibilities with Epstein, a comment behind which I stand." "I've, of course, reported what Alan Dershowitz has said as his lawyer." "He says, I think he would have told me." "He didn't say he had any of those connections." "I hear all that. That doesn't mean it's not true." "It's one of the many things that should be explored around Epstein." "But saying that and also saying he might be a US asset, etcetera, doesn't make you antisemitic."

In a focus group, participants debate how canceling Tucker Carlson would affect antisemitism and whether labeling opponents as anti Semitic is productive. One says, 'if we were to cancel Tucker, would anti antisemitism increase or decrease?' The response: 'I think increase because that means any supporter of Tucker Carlson's statement therefore makes them anti semitic. Don't association. Mhmm. 100%.' They critique a binary: 'the binary that's presented is that if you don't passionately talk about it, you are a hater.' The discussion shifts to Israel, with a participant stating, 'I love Israel. I visited there,' and describing American concerns: 'we are, like, flooded with illegals, and no one speaks English, and our hospitals are clogged.' They urge to 'reject the Jew hate' but warn against labeling everyone anti Semite for opposing Netanyahu: 'it's bad for everybody.' They ask, 'welcome us not talking about Israel nearly as much? Yes. 100%.' Finally, they frame the issue as a 'messaging problem' and warn, 'there's an earthquake coming on this issue'—'hear it from people themselves.'

Speaker argues that 'you and the Likud party are cut from the same ideological cloth as Trump and the GOP in America.' They reference 'Charlie Kirk's assassination, who was a big mentor of mine' and say 'Evangelicals, from all my research, evangelicals are the reason that Israel has been supported in public sphere outside of just Jews.' They note 'So with Charlie's assassination and with the kind of trajectory that we see with, like, Candace Owens and Tucker Carlson.' They ask 'what's another game plan if we lose evangelical support for the state of Israel.' 'What's our backup plan to be strong, like outside of the diaspora?'

"If Bibi Netanyahu, if he does something I don't like and if I criticize it, am I, like, a bad Christian? Absolutely not." "What I find strange is that we're able to criticize the American government sometimes in the Christian world with more freedom than the Israeli government." "To be pro Israel means you believe in the nation of Israel Mhmm. Not necessarily the government of Israel." "When you when Joe Biden was president, you and I were what we loved America, but we detested our government." "And those two things beautifully coexisted." "If they challenge a foreign government, which is what happens so often." "Right. Like you're a bad Christian if you have a question about a foreign government." "Right. That creates backlash that I don't think people understand."

Speaker 0 argues there are definitely people who hit Israel who are not anti Semites, ranging from religious motives to threats, asking, "Why attack people who are pretty reasonable... Why denounce them as dangerous antisemites?" Speaker 1 recalls that on Piers Morgan he said Israel was "losing the PR war, that they had lost the Democrats and the independents and were starting to lose the Republican Party in America," and that it was "Time to wrap it up." At Turning Point at Student Action Summit with Charlie, they discussed Epstein and Pam Bondi, and whether he might possibly be an asset, "and Israel, yeah, would make sense to me." After two years of defending them every week turned some weird crowd into she's an anti Semite. "So, I mean, eff these people because it's a lie." They say Charlie Kirk "faced" a smear for hosting you and inviting Dave Smith; "the Israel side fully represented too." Charlie was "31" and "under 30 is against Israel." They call his stance "brave and noble" and say he "did not deserve to be smeared."

There's a range of views on Israel—from those who hit Israel who are not anti-Semites to others with 'religious reasons for wanting to blow up Israel'—'those are all threats' and questions arise, 'Why attack people who are pretty reasonable... Why denounce them as dangerous antisemites?' He said, 'Israel was losing the PR war, that they had lost Democrats and independents and were starting to lose the Republican Party in America, and it was time to wrap it up.' At Turning Point with Charlie, they discussed Epstein and Pam Bondi; 'Israel, yeah, would make sense to me.' After two years defending Israel, 'some weird crowd' labeled them 'she's an anti Semite,' and they cried, 'eff these people because it's a lie.' Charlie 'had said nothing, like, nothing' and was smeared; '31,' a youth voice, 'under 30 is against Israel.' 'I'm on their side.' 'I know you want your hostages back, but it this cannot go on until you have every hostage.' 'You've had a two year long leash.'

This episode features a wide‑ranging, free‑form discussion of politics, media, and conspiracy theories. The speakers touch on being labeled antisemitic after hosting guests and reference volatile events around Charlie Kirk, Jeffrey Epstein, and Trump, asserting deep Israeli influence over U.S. policy. They claim Jewish donors and networks (APAC, Heritage Foundation’s Project Esther) steer government, media, and finance, and advocate an uncompromising, “America first” stance without softening their message. The conversation shifts to foreign policy in Venezuela, Ukraine, and Iran, alleging occupation and betrayal by U.S. leaders tied to Israel. They criticize figures like Alex Jones, Nick Fuentes, and Tucker Carlson, and discuss internal MAGA divisions and alleged dual loyalties. The later segments promote the J Proof crypto project and related sponsors, alongside discussions of censorship, billboards, and broader controversial histories surrounding Israel, 9/11, and the Holocaust.

Speaker argues that "And that suits the Israelis just fine." They question how much antisemitic content about Israel online is organic, noting there are "haters" and asking "how much of it is not organic at all?" They contend that some messaging is "being ginned up on purpose to make legitimate questions about the US government's relationship with the government of Israel seem like crackpot stuff, like hate, like David Duke level lunacy?" They add, "Probably some because it serves their interest." They insist the "true villain here" is not "the state of Israel, the Jews" but "the United States" and its leaders, who are "putting up with this." Israel is "a small country with very limited resources" trying to serve its own interests. "You'd think every country would act that way, and most do," yet "there are some that don't, and ours would top that list."

Speakers discuss Netanyahu’s influence: "He's using The United States, its economy, and its military power for his own ends." They note it's common but "remarkable how effective he's been at that and how contemptuous he is." "80% of Americans support us." They warn U.S. support is "tens of billions a year." "Phoebe Netanyahu is a foreigner." Concerns about Lindsey Graham and Ted Cruz surface: "Ted Cruz says right into the camera, I was elected. My main goal was to help Israel." They argue antisemitism is "a dodge" and that "anti Semitism very often is a way to pass the buck. It's their fault." They contend Netanyahu is a threat—"I think that clearly they're gonna try and blow up Al Aqsa Mosque" to "build the third temple"—and ask, "Where's our self respect?" "I am way, way more angry at my leaders than I am at Netanyahu."

Speaker 0 describes the backlash: "The behavior by a lot, both privately and publicly, are pushing people like you and me away." He adds: "I am learning biblical Hebrew and writing a book on the Shabbat. I honor the Shabbat, literally the Jewish Sabbath. I visit Israel and fight for it." He asserts identity and support: "Yes. I'm an American citizen." "Yes. I want Israel to win." "But my moral character is now being put into question." He emphasizes the impact of online discourse: "Well, you and I believe that we're Americans and Americans first, period. End of story. We are citizens of this nation." He cites: "And the thing about Epstein is just so bizarre. I don't know who he was an agent for. It might have been Israel or an asset, or it might have been nobody, but we're allowed to speculate about that. It's like just some rule. You can't go there when it comes to Israel." He concludes with: "I love Israel."