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@ShivAroor - Shiv Aroor
If your bullsh!t alarm has been ringing over the F-15 pilot rescue op story, listen to this chat I had with @Iyervval & @joe_sameer. https://t.co/5WZmaiLLib
Video Transcript AI Summary
Speaker 0 introduces a “hidden operation theory” about the F-15 down and the rescue, describing it as a conspiracy theory that has emerged. The claim is that US special forces were already on the ground inside Iran when the F-15 was shot down, with the rescue location near the Isfahan nuclear site. The theory suggests the ground operation’s objective could have been to target nuclear material or uranium, and that the F-15’s role may have been to sanitize airspace to facilitate the ground operation. The theory posits the F-15 was shot down by Iran, the ground operation was exposed, and the extraction became urgent, turning a ground operation into a rescue because it went sideways. The official US version is that the operation was a combat search and rescue (CSAR) to recover the downed pilot, with heavy fire during extraction and no comment on covert operations. The question is why big aircraft were used to remove one pilot.
Speaker 1 (Sameer Joshi) acknowledges there are missing pieces but remains focused on CSAR as the main interpretation of the first few days. He notes on the first day: one C-130, one MC-130, and two Blackhawks (HH-60s) were sent; one pilot was recovered. The WSO was in communicado for about 24 hours, planning and hiding, and his message confounded observers. The C-130s and tankers fed the mission; jamming and electronic warfare were employed to discourage Iranian regrouping. The US would have faced opposition on the ground; the field selected was a former Iranian agricultural airfield where two MH-130s landed. The Delta or C-6 aircraft provided support, creating a perimeter while smaller roving patrol helicopters watched for threats. The combination of Reapers and fighters (A-10s, F-15Es) supported a plausible, well-planned operation. The US would have faced ground-fire but proceeded to recover the WSO and pilot, with details still undisclosed. Once resources were committed and the operation appeared successful, CENTCOM framed it as an audacious mission with a visible payoff in the pilot’s return. He believes this is the likely scenario and notes there may be other theories, but focuses on the ongoing operation’s positive outcome.
Speaker 0 agrees, noting that covert operations may prevent full disclosure and that the discussion is warranted given war aims and endgame questions. Abhijit (Speaker 2) is introduced to comment on the C-130s being stuck in the mud. He explains skepticism: there may have been another ceasefire operation, but the area’s terrain (high altitude around 6,000 feet) and dust are relevant. He references a historical parallel to 1979/1980 hostage rescues in which CH-53 Stallions were grounded by dust storms. He argues the US “never makes the same mistake twice” and doubts the dust-in-fuel explanation for the two downed helicopters, noting the precision planning typical of American operations (geologists, site surveys). He cites the Abbottabad raid as another example and questions the plausibility of both helicopters going down in the same way. He concludes he is not buying the dust explanation and emphasizes the need for granular, well-planned execution.
Speaker 0 thanks Sameer and Abhijit for their insights, acknowledging the balance between the mission’s audacity and the questions it raises, and notes the discussion is valuable for understanding what is being dealt with.
Full Transcript
Speaker 0: We know a lot but we also don't know a huge amount of what really happened. Now there is this hidden operation theory that you heard Sameer actually refer to. Let me just explain to you what it is. It's a conspiracy theory that has emerged now. I've been talking about it as well.
The claim is that US special forces were already on the ground. A ground operation was already underway inside Iran when this F 15 was shot down. The location where this pilot has been rescued from is eerily very close to the Isfahan nuclear site. Now the objective we don't know what it is but some commentators say maybe that ground operation and ground presence that was there that we are told was sent in in response to the shutdown pilot was already there and its target was to make a move on nuclear material and possibly the uranium. It might sound far fetched but we don't know it's being suggested.
The F-fifteen's role conversely apart from just conducting air strikes may have been to sanitize airspace or ground space in order to facilitate this ground operation not the other way around. So you now understand what that suggestion is. So the F 15 rescue, the hidden operation theory suggests that the F 15 was shot down by Iran, air superiority was challenged, the ground operation was then potentially exposed and the extraction became much more urgent. So a ground operation was converted into a rescue operation because that actually went sideways. Now the official U.
S. Version is the one that we've been talking about that the operation was purely a combat search and rescue operation in response to an F-fifteen pilot being shot down and not the other way around. The aim was to recover the downed pilot, heavy fire took place during the extraction, no comment on the covert operations so far. Many are wondering why would you need to send big aircraft of this kind to remove just one pilot.
Speaker 1: There are
Speaker 0: those who say well you need those aircraft because those are the ones that would carry the small little helicopters which finally picked up that pilot from on top of a mountain. Samir Joshi continues to be with us. Abhijit Ayar Mitra also a geopolitics and strategic affairs commentator who's been sounding a note of skepticism on this very issue is also live with me. Abhijit, welcome. Why are you skeptical about the mother of all rescues story, Abhijit?
Welcome.
Speaker 2: Thank you. Look. It's equally true that there may have been a ceasefire operation going on, and there was another operation going on. Okay. The and we don't know what we've seen.
First of all, when they go in for combat search and rescue, they jam the living daylights out of that area. For an already you have an Internet outage happening in Iran at the moment. Now if you remember, in 2006 when the Israelis had started bombing a huge bombing campaign of Lebanon, The French and the British had sent these well, the British had sent these warships with the s eighteen fifteen radar, this particular one, and the German APAR radars there. They had jammed the commune just the radar signals had caused an outage of all communications in Northern Israel for two, three days. Now that imagine that is just a radar.
That is not even jamming that has happened. The American would have almost certainly been using growlers and things like that to provide electronic support, which should have jammed that entire area senseless. It isn't making sense out here. An f 35 flying so low, images coming in so thick, fast, and quick. You know, I don't think people realize some methods of those American brute force jamming, they will actually destroy the circuits on your phone.
They they will render things inoperable. Beyond seeing that, there's a lot about this that isn't adding up. I I honestly, there there are hundreds of different explanations out here. It is admirable, of course, that they expend so much resources to rescue two pilots. Yeah.
I don't think I don't know if we do that. We certainly haven't had the opportunity to do that in the past, but something here isn't adding up. The is it fair that you will, you know, vector the pilot away from a high, once you know you're hit? Remember, once you're hit, you don't just fall down immediately necessarily. You will glide down, to a safe spot and things like that, which is probably what happened out here.
Being found near Natanz is not that much of a coincidence. It's a target, therefore, must have been bombing Natanz. Very natural to be doing that. The rest of the things, there are too many holes here that don't make sense.
Speaker 0: Sameer, you know many missing pieces and we talked about this as well. Abhijit says you know it's very possible that the combat search and rescue and a possible you know ground operation underway, you know it's not very far fetched. It's very possible that this could have happened and in the world of special operations we may never know. Does anything stand out to you as making this a possible scenario?
Speaker 1: Given what we are seeing and the information which is coming out, while I would like to keep that at the back of my mind, I still want to focus on the combat search and rescue op as the mainstay of these two, three days. When we analyze this in a finite manner, you will realize that on the first day, they sent across one C130 and, MC one 30 along with two Blackhawks, the the HH sixties. That mission recovered one pilot. And what you will recall is that the WSO, the weapon system officer, he was in Communicado for good about twenty four hours in which he was planning, he was hiding, he was getting away, he was climbing. He was he was doing a lot of other stuff.
But and and with his message that got his kind or that equivalent, I mean, in whatever way which kind of, know, foxed everybody. But in those twenty four hours, the US Air Force managed to recover one pilot. They learned that they will face opposition on the ground. The HH sixties took a lot of hits. The the the c one three zero would have also done the same, the tanker version which had gone across to feed them.
They were better prepared. In the meantime, there was a lot of jamming operations, as Avitiks also mentioned, to kind of discourage the Iranians to regroup. The Iranians also faced the same tough terrain which the WSO was navigating at that time. They did not know the exact location. Is it, now now this is where the Americans would have realized that this operation will take a bit of time.
They wouldn't require more resources on the ground. Now as it happens, is it a coincidence that the field they selected, which was a former agricultural, you know, field aircraft field of the Iranians, that is where they they landed the two MH one one three zeros. And out of that, you know, the special operation aviation regiment x sixties, the smaller aircraft Yeah. Which on which the Deltas or the c six were writing shotgun. So because now they had a larger area to scavenge the to to kind of recce around and put up a perimeter, they would require assets to fly around.
They they would not have the number of troops. So even if assuming that, you know, they had two helicopters which were a roving patrol to kind of keep, the anything which they expected, in addition to the firepower coming from the Reapers and
Speaker 0: Yeah.
Speaker 1: You know, other jets like the a ten's as well as the f 15 e's, This is a very plausible kind of, you know, op, which was planned. The US is the only nation in the world which can put across so many assets in this finite amount of time. This is a playbook which is kind of unfolding. It is a very classic playbook. Now what would have happened?
Yes. They would have faced because they are still targets in disguise. The Iranians would have had a lot of Cajun steak pot shots. Did the, the the c one three zeros kind of got hit? Did the H sixties get hit and they were recovered and they were not in a position to be kind of recovered back.
At the same time, the special operation, you know, executives, they would have picked up the WSO and got into that site. So all this was done. And we do not know the details. All this was done. In the end, we know that The U.
S. Has scuttled to C-one 130 equivalents there and plus MH six class of aircraft there and they were still recovered. They were, you know, for the C-130s or C-295s, all this will come out in more detail. I hope it does. Once you have committed resources, I'll just finish.
Yes. Once you have committed resources and there is an op, which is going in a positive manner, you will throw in the kind of the operational, bravado, which kind of was undertaken by the CENTCOM. It was a mission which was seen the success, the light of the day was visible and the pilot was, you know, coming back home. So I think this is where we should focus. Yeah.
It is a coincidence. There may be a lot of, other theories. Yeah. At this juncture, I'm just focusing on this
Speaker 0: I take your point. I I I take your point and I think I agree also with you, but it's just that given the fact that this is an operation that's underway and we may never actually see the full picture because these are special forces covert operations as it were. It definitely warrants a discussion especially given the war aims and objectives that have meandered through this entire operation and the world wants to know when the war is going to end. But Abhijit amidst all these details, amidst this operation one aspect that you've also sort of picked on is the C-130s. Them being brought in getting stuck in the mud.
You're incredulous about that as well. I understand you've posted on social media as well. Why are you not buying that aspect of it? What what stands out to you? And the reason I ask is because a lot of people have focused on that aspect and said this doesn't really fly.
Speaker 2: So, you know, I've been to a a waterfall in that particular area, where these things if if the reported coordinates are right, I've been to that area. It's an elevation of around 6,000 feet. The, you know, sand and dust and things like that, the landscape generally is a very barren, dusty landscape in much the same way that Daulat Oldebeg is. Also remember, other planes were also shot down by the Iranians, damaged by the Iranians over this. And we also need to remember, they faced this exact same situation when they attempted a hostage rescue in, 1979 or 1980, where their helicopters, the c h 53 stallions, got stuck in the desert, and the exact same thing happened.
Well, they miscalculated. They hit a dust storm. It the they malfunctioned, and they had to be evacuated and things like that. A big humiliation. The reason I'm not buying it is the one thing we know about the Americans is they never make the same mistake twice.
They make, mistakes. They learn from their mistakes. It is a very open system which allows people to learn from their mistakes. They're making the same mistake of battle hardened, CSR, spec ops, one thirty like that. Mhmm.
I'm not buying it was dust in in fuel injection, whatever, into the engines that put it down? One, maybe. Two, I think not. Remember, they lost a helicopter in the Abbottabad Osama Bin Laden Raid. Right?
One. For two of those planes to go down the exact same way, we know how the Americans plan these things. They are so fine and granular in their detail. They go and they have geologists and things like that who probably surveyed that area, know the grain type, know what can fly, what can't fly, etcetera etcetera. I'm not buying it.
Speaker 0: Okay. Interesting. This is healthy skepticism and I'm glad that on tonight's show we've been able to reflect both the audacity, the amazingness of the mission, but also these questions that are coming out. Not from you know social media commentators but there are genuine people who are asking questions of this operation and I think they warrant asking as well but it helps us understand in a whole better light what we're actually dealing with here. Sameer and Abhijit, thank you very much for your time tonight on India matters.
Thank you.
@ShivAroor - Shiv Aroor
A second video of the mid-air collision, taken from Reagan Washington Airport outside DC. Clear that the US Army Black Hawk flew right into the American Airlines passenger jet’s landing path. Terribly tragic. 19 bodies recovered from the Potomac river, search on for more. https://t.co/yRTRQoN28j
Video Transcript AI Summary
Okay, here's the concise transcript:
Wilson Bridge tower, I'm short of Runway 33, requesting a change to start. Runway 33, cleared to land. That's 25Romeo. That's 251. That's 25002 in flight. That's 25F on the CRJ, likely the aircraft inside. 472. American 30 1 30, go around, 250.
Full Transcript
Speaker 0: 3 40 2 at the Wilson Bridge tank short change to start Runway 33. Runway 3 3 cleared for land. That's 25Romeo. That's 251. That's 25002 in flight.
That's 25F on the CRJ. That's probably the aircraft inside. 472. American 30 1 30, go around 250.
@ShivAroor - Shiv Aroor
White guy mourning the end of the White people era 😂 @Steve_Laws_ https://t.co/1V6QtMbald
